Lucian Paul Smith's ifMUD Forum Interview

Hello! This is a copy of the transcript from Lucian Smith's interview, held on 25 April 1998. This took place at the ifMUD.

Although I was unable to participate, Lucian was kind enough to publish a text version of his interview which I have converted into HTML in an attempt to make it easy on the eyes.

Saudade says, "Welcome, everybody, we're back at it, talking about writing and programming IF." Adam says, "Remember: all questions must be asked in the form of a drawing." lpsmith grins. Saudade says, "Please don't talk during the interview, but it's okay to emote -- emoting adds presence and interest." JCZorkmid is present, adding presence. Saudade says, "If Lucian's answer ends with 3 dots, wait a second until he finishes. During the question period, raise your hand to be called on." Dan_Wood nods Adam knows all the questions to be asked, adding prescience. Dan_Wood raises his hand Saudade says, "We'll try to end in an hour; your questions after about 1/2 hour or so." Saudade asks, "Yes, Dan?" Dan_Wood asks, "Is there going to be a test?" JCZorkmid giggles. Saudade says, "Probably someday. Pay attention and you'll pass." Ivan smacks Dan_Wood. Dan_Wood falls off his chair, "Ow." (From Saudade) A spotlight cuts through the shadows, then settles on a hairy ape-like creature who is sniffing a drink over at the bar. Looks like he might be willing to chat a bit, if you can understand his language... Ivan gives an apple to Saudade. Adam whispers to Dan_Wood, "That's a cruel question to ask a public school teacher." Saudade says, "Today's speaker is Lucian Paul Smith, author of Edifice, which won first place in the 1997 IF Competition, and also garnered the Best Puzzle Award at the 1997 Xyzzy Awards ceremony. Lucian is a grad student in biochemistry and cell biology at Rice University, specializing in computational biology." Saudade says, "His web page is at: http://www.bioc.rice.edu/~lpsmith/lpsmith.html. Lucian has contributed to the study of patterns in IF (http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?LucianSmith) and has also written the invisiclues for Andrew Plotkin's game So Far. Thanks for agreeing to speak with us, Lucian." mamster has arrived. mamster says, "D'oh." lpsmith says (to mamster), "Just in time." Dan_Wood exclaims, "Timing!" lpsmith bows. JCZorkmid claps. Saudade asks, "You mentioned finding the Competition and becoming motivated to write your own game for it. Did you play around with a number of different story ideas before you settled on the plot of Edifice, or were you pretty sure of that idea from the start?" Dan_Wood applauds and throws roses lpsmith says, "I had two or three ideas at the time, one of which I picked to scale down and make into a competition entry. The rest of the ideas are still in the development stage ;-) However, it's also true that my other ideas were not remotely like that for 'Edifice'--its overall structure and 'plot' are pretty much identical to my initial conception of the idea. That idea was also most obviously the best suited for making a 2-hour game." Saudade says, "Do you consider Edifice to be a 2 hr. game, then? It took me longer than that." lpsmith chuckles. lpsmith says, "Well, I *tried*,..." cody finished it in 5 minutes. Dan_Wood nods heartedly. lpsmith says, "It was actually very difficult to judge how long it would take to play,..." lpsmith says, "I finally just settled on three levels, and hoped for the best. I overshot a bit, but I think it was close." Saudade asks, "I'm interested in probing a little deeper concerning your choice of evolutionary milestones in Edifice. As I played the game, I noticed the following key elements as important to the evolution of your character: use of the rock and the spear (tools), the discovery of fire for cooking, the learning of different languages, and the domestication of the horse. Why did you pick those? Why not agriculture, written language, religion, or political organization?" lpsmith says, "Part of my original conception of the game was that the first thing the player would do would be hunt down some food. This was initially going to be the 'outside the Edifice' scene, but I moved it to the first level later, deciding to put something even simpler outside. The discovery of fire was another obvious possibility which seemed easy to implement, and had a logical connection with hunting, so I added that to the scene, as well." lpsmith says, "For the other two levels, I picked early developments that I felt I could model. I also tried to make a logical progression, so you could see the effects you were having on the world--the invention of fire was seen in the firepit in the second level; the discovery of language allowed communities to form for the third. It's interesting that you mention agriculture--I was originally planning another level where you discovered agriculture, which would have come between the second and third levels. That was nicked due to time constraints--also, it would have made Edifice *way* too long. The last vestiges of that idea can be seen on Level Four (although I *might* code it up at some point, if only to see how it worked--I had some interesting ideas for that bit). Your other suggestions could have been implemented as later levels of Edifice, but the idea was to start near the beginning and use small steps. Also, more abstract advances would have required more creativity on my part to make it work. Since this was my first game, I wanted to stick with things I could do relatively easily." lpsmith is a speed-typer, obviously. Dan_Wood mutters to mamster, (Or he's copying and pasting.) lpsmith looks innocent. Saudade says, "This is a cut and paste duel, of course." mamster exclaims, "Fight!" Saudade asks, "Many people commented on the near perfect illusion of interactivity in the language puzzle. What do you think was the key factor in making that puzzle work so well?" lpsmith says, "Limited, complete scope." lpsmith says, "Limited scope in that Stranger's entire vocabulary was around 25 words. Complete in that almost all logical combinations of said vocabulary produced unique responses, and much of the illogical combinations produced at least *some* response that led the player in the right direction (hopefully). Also, this was fleshed out even more by providing responses to showing/pointing at items. Finally, I didn't require that the player understand the entirety of the language--just enough to communicate his plight. In this way, the player was less likely to test the edges of the simulation, where it was more likely to break down." Saudade says, "Hmmm. " Saudade asks, "Some of my favorite puzzles in IF involve the illusion of movement and riding on things. Learning to ride the horse was quite delightful in your game does bareback riding really work that way?" lpsmith laughs. lpsmith says, "Unfortunately, I don't know. I did do a little web research trying to find info on it before I designed the puzzle, but while I found some information on riding bareback today, I couldn't find anything on what it would have been like the first time, so I ended up just making it up. I did discover an appropriate method to make him stop completely, which I incorporated into the design." Saudade says, "So, if I'm ever in the situation, I'd better experiment more carefully, eh? :)" lpsmith says, "I've ridden a horse a few times, but always with a saddle." lpsmith grins. Saudade asks, "The literature versus the game-and-puzzle theme is something that many of us come down on one side or the other of. Where do you see your major interest as lying, with the puzzles, the story, or somewhere in between?" lpsmith says, "I would like to fully embrace both. In IF, they need each other, and might as well learn how to get along. If anything, I'm most interested in the interface between the two--I was fascinated by the way putting things in close proximity to each other both solved puzzles and furthered the overall metaphor in 'So Far', for example. In my game, the language puzzle is both the plot and the puzzle for the second level. Both are potential answers to the 'crossword vs. narrative' problem." lpsmith writes a level of the Edifice where you solve the crossword vs. narrative problem. cody gives horse to lpsmith. Ivan's chair scrapes loudly, as he tries to head surreptitiously for the exit. "Heh heh. Oops. Sorry, but I gotta get going. Thanks, Saudade and Lucian!" inky waves. lpsmith nods to Ivan. Ivan has disconnected. Ivan suddenly disappears into the ether. [Ivan] The heavens cleave asunder. A brilliant beam of light issues forth, bathing Ivan in its radiance. As it fades, so does he. Saudade asks, "You wrote your tale as a sort of Everyman -- what problems did that present that might have been different with an individual PC?" lpsmith says, "Well, I tried to make 'Everyman' *into* a unique, individual character. The idea, at least, was to guide the player into a role where they would know they should discover the various human breakthroughs through time. On the second and third level, I gave the player additional roles to fill (father in a family and head of a village). Generally, I like giving the player a role more than making them generic--and I like to play more fully developed characters, too. It *can* be done the other way, but I don't prefer it." JCZorkmid smiles. [DorianX] It doesn't mean much... It doesn't mean anything at all.... DorianX has arrived. Saudade shuffles papers. Saudade asks, "What were the most challenging problems you faced in writing and programming Edifice?" lpsmith says, "Each level presented its own unique programming challenges. For the first level, the most difficult part was getting Beast to stay in the correct position relative to the player as the player wandered around--that area was implemented as one room. That was difficult in that it was hard to keep track of--there were different directions and different distances that all had to make sense as the player wandered around." lpsmith says, "The second level's difficulty, of course, was Stranger. There was some trickiness parsing player input, but far and away the most difficult part of it was the sheer volume of responses I had to type up. It got rather disheartening after a while." Dan_Wood yells at the stage, "Running from the church!" lpsmith is suddenly confused, but presses on. lpsmith says, "The third level had a rather complex daemon keeping track of how far the player had gotten avoiding the various things, and what position they were in (he said vaguely, hoping to avoid spoilers). I had various properties with routines calling other properties with routines, and it was a bit tricky making sure they all worked together." lpsmith says, "Writing,...dunno. I sat and stared at the screen a lot, but not for any readily discernable reason. Just couldn't think of anything to say. It was definitely an interesting challenge to write descriptions that were succinct and would withstand being read several times in different situations." Saudade asks, "What would you do differently if you had it to do over again?" lpsmith says, "There's a couple things (at least)." lpsmith says, "One idea that didn't make it into the final game was that of having your tools change from level to level. Rock did change to Useful Rock, but I would have liked to do more of that, and make it more extensive--one idea was to change Spear into Arrow just by taking it to a different level, for instance. (That reminds me--anther idea that got axed for time was to have the player discover the bow & arrow on level 3 as an additional resource against Marauders.)" mamster cheers Useful Rock. lpsmith bows. lpsmith says, "Another thing I would work on more is the player's motivation on the first level. As Duncan Stevens wrote, there's less of a sense of why the character *wants* to discover things other than having the setup be obvious to a 20th-century player. Also, the way death worked on that level left a little to be desired--as we talked about on the MUD recently, even though the player is immediately 'resurrected', the player still is punished by having to replay swaths of the adventure on that level. If I could dream up a better motivation here, I'd put it in." JCZorkmid laughs. Saudade laughs. She realizes that sending the interviewee the questions without knowing the answers gives them the advantage in the duel. (From lpsmith) Thrust, parry, dodge, spin! Saudade asks, "Can you talk a little about your interest in patterns in Interactive Fiction? What is that all about?" lpsmith says, "Ah, patterns. A while back, Marnix Klooster posted to raif, having just read a book about patterns, which fascinated him. Lesse if I can find the URL's--ah, there they are. http://x1.dejanews.com/getdoc.xp?AN=240149141 and http://x1.dejanews.com/getdoc.xp?AN=240432002 For whatever reason, I latched on to those ideas, and took off. Marnix hasn't done anything there for a while, but I still visit on occasion, adding a few new things. The pages haven't reached critical mass yet, but I think there's a lot of potential there." lpsmith says, "To back up and explain things a bit: A 'pattern' is a slippery beast to define, but in 20 words or less: it's a particular way to express a holistic solution to a common problem. Typically, patterns try to embody years of experience in a way beginners can assimilate easily and in a form from which old-timers can extrapolate. I've written up patterns about writing hints, coding rope, and nudging the player towards the right grammar. I've tried to use them as a way to codify the vast amount of experience I've seen on the newsgroups and on the web, so others don't have to wade through tons of posts to get the same information. It's met with some success--but there's no real IF-patterns community yet, and it'll need that if it ever takes off. Maybe Marnix will come out of hibernation one of these years,..." Dan_Wood scoffs, "Only if we bait him out with food." mamster says, "Mmm...Klooster-snacks." inky says, "heh." lpsmith uses beast-meat to lure Marnix. Saudade asks, "What advice do you have for newbie IF writers as they attempt to produce a game?" lpsmith exclaims, "Come on in--the water's fine!" lpsmith says, "Actually, my advice would be: start small, and build. I got part way through 'Ruins', experimenting as I went, then jumped to coding Comp97 (which started off much simpler than it is today), then went to 'Edifice'. In 'Edifice', I probably spent as much time on the opening room as I did on each level. (Well, OK, so that's an exaggeration. But not so big a one.) Edifice's structure made it ideal from a first-time development point of view, though, since I could work on one level at a time, and get it to work almost completely before going on to work on the next. These sorts of milestones are important for your sanity, if nothing else. First get it to work. Then worry about the fancy stuff." mamster says, "Mmm...beast-meat." Saudade asks, "What are your favorite IF games, and what type of IF do you prefer to play?" lpsmith says, "Whew! Well, lemme dig out my ratings for the '96 comp." (From lpsmith) (sounds of shuffling papers--well, OK, files) lpsmith says, "OK, I gave top marks to Tapestry, Alien Abduction, Maiden of the Moonlight, Kissing, Aayela, Stargazer, Sherbet, and Reverberations. My full ratings are on deja at http://x1.dejanews.com/getdoc.xp?AN=203201768 I also reallyreally liked 'So Far', and had great fun with 'Tangle'. I liked the standard Infocom faves (Trinity, AMFV, Plundered Hearts), and the standard rgif faves (Curses, Christminster),... Generally, I like games with atmosphere, and if it has something to say, I like it even better. I enjoy puzzles as intellectual exercises (I'm an avid 'GAMES' subscriber), so if they aren't integrated well I don't mind *too* much,... but I much prefer well-integrated puzzles." mamster says, "Reverberations ruled." Saudade exclaims, "Hey I love Games mag too!" lpsmith shakes Saudade's hand. Saudade asks, "What do you hope to be doing in 5 years? And, does IF have a place in that future?" lpsmith says, "Well, the *plan* is to be living in Seattle, and doing science. Whether I'll work for a university or in industry has yet to be determined. But whatever I'm doing, I hope IF will still be a hobby. I recently got the opportunity to go to a game developer's conference in Austin, TX, so I got to see the gaming community from an insider's perspective. It's crazy out there. 'Steady income' is not a phrase you will hear these people use. But if I can have fun and avoid the insanity by keeping it a hobby, I'm there all the way." (From Adam) Johnny Rotten declares, "NO FUTURE!" JCZorkmid laughs. Dan_Wood sics the grue bouncer on Johnny Rotten. lpsmith chuckles, as if he knew who Johnny Rotten was. Saudade asks, "Finally, I'd like to ask: What IS computational biology, anyway?" lpsmith chuckles. lpsmith asks, "Computational biology is anything involving calculating complicated things on a computer about biological topics. I'm personally working on modelling protein structures on the computer, to see if we can use existing structures to help us extrapolate what new structures should look like. Does that help?" Saudade says, "Yes, thanks! Now for a few questions from the Mud:" JCZorkmid's brain overflows. Dan_Wood raises his hand. Saudade says, "Wait, Dan..." Saudade says, "We have some from a post at the Mud first -- people wrote them down." Saudade asks, "DGlasser: What was the most difficult part of Edifice to write?" Dan_Wood bahs and sulks away from the microphone. lpsmith assures Dan his time will come. Saudade pats Dan on the shoulder. There there. lpsmith says, "Well, I've already talking about what the programming challenges were. Psychologically, it was most difficult to just keep plugging away at it, a little each day. I found that working on it each morning for a half hour or so worked pretty well for me, as long as I could keep myself from playing FreeCell too much. And life intruded a lot--my wife was in a car accident and was uninjured, but the car was totalled and we had to go through the hassle of getting a new one. Then one month later, we got a notice that they were tearing our apartment complex down in a month and we had to move, so that meant the hassle of finding a new place--at the beginning of the school year, when everyone *else* is also looking for a place,... not fun. Fortunately, the game was in beta by this point, so once we finally got settled in our new place, I set up the computer and worked through all the bug reports that had been accumulating." mamster must go. Thanks, LP! mamster has disconnected. mamster heads back to Jolly Roger's. Saudade says, "Whew! Now, from Dilbon: Fa ben lalse? Ne salum y ben krande." lpsmith shakes his head. "Fe salum y ben selme. Lalse fa ben." Saudade groans. Adam says, "Al kharuf rakada amama al khayid." lpsmith says, "That, too." Saudade asks, "Can you translate the question and the answer, please?" Taj wonder if Babelfish can do Strangerese yet. lpsmith says, "That would be cheating ;-)" Saudade says, "Aaarghh again." Dan_Wood yells at the stage, "ANSI Standard C, please!" Saudade asks, "inky: Have you had any personal experience with evolution?" lpsmith exclaims, "I'm evolving every day!" lpsmith evolves past you all, to level 452. inky says, "woohoo" Dan_Wood bahs and sics a rust monster on lpsmith. cody exclaims, "Oooh. High score!" Saudade asks, "From markm: What was the most personally satisfying experience in writing Edifice?" lpsmith says, "Well, there's a difference if you mean satisfying while writing it, or satisfying after people played it. While writing it, it was satisfying to see things work. The irregularities on the Edifice. The wandering Beast. The changing smells. I took particular joy in making the parser less obvious to the player--putting in extra verbs and making sure various phrasings were accepted. After it was played, I was pleased but startled by how well people took to the language puzzle. I was also startled that Edifice got 'Best Puzzles' in the XYZZYies. I guess my attempt to integrate the puzzle and the story parts of the game worked better than I expected. And that's immensely satisfying." Saudade asks, "Just as an aside, how many hours do you think you spent writing it?" lpsmith says, "That's a good question." lpsmith ponders. Dan_Wood yells at the stage, "Too damn long!" lpsmith says, "6-7 months, maybe an average of a half hour a day (sometimes more, sometimes less,...)" lpsmith points at Dan. "What he said." Saudade asks, "From Christopher: What do you think is the worst part of Edifice?" lpsmith says, "The ending left a little to be desired, I thought, although I think that's part of the structure of the story I was telling. The third level was also a bit sketchy, since I did it last, and had the least amount of time to work on it. " Saudade asks, "from Jarbigruen: How did you determine the structure for the language in Edifice?" lpsmith says, "I'll let you in on a little secret." lpsmith leans in close. You strain to hear him. lpsmith whispers, "There is no structure to Stranger's language." lpsmith's eyes twinkle. inky exclaims, "boooo!" lpsmith says, "Seriously, there is no word order, and there are no word endings that imply a part of speech. Mostly, I didn't want to try to parse that information in player input. If you want to know much much more, I've written an article for the next XYZZYnews that has the genesis and implementation of the language puzzle in it, and I'll be simultaneously releasing code that mimics the puzzle to gmd as a source example." (From inky) angry crowds mob the stage. lpsmith wards off the angry mob deftly. Grocible grins. Dan_Wood throws potatoes at the stage Saudade purses her lips a bit. lpsmith asks (to Saudade), "Yes?" Saudade asks, "From Dilbon: Have you ever studied linguistics?" lpsmith says, "Not as such. I took French in Jr. High/High School, and Latin in college. We also touched on linguistics in my Intro to Anthropology class, but no, no other training." Saudade exclaims (to Dan), "Okay! Now, you're on!" Adam pushes Dan_Wood to the floor and raises his hand. lpsmith exclaims, "Fight!" Saudade is laughing out loud. (From Adam) Dan_Wood says, "Uh... I forgot." JCZorkmid helps Dan up. lpsmith laughs some more, and calls on Adam, then. Adam exclaims, "Yay!" Saudade thinks she lost the duel AND the train of thought. Dan_Wood decks Adam, "When faced with a story but no puzzles, how do you think one should proceed?" Adam says, "Dan can go first, of course." lpsmith says, "That's how I made it to level 452." (From DorianX) Dan_Wood gets knocked down, but he gets up again. (From Grocible) chuff chuff chuff lpsmith considers the question. lpsmith says, "Try to think of the story in terms of how the hero gets challenged." DorianX raises his hand Adam raises his hand. lpsmith says, "Then try to convert these challenges into 'puzzles'." DorianX lowers his hand Dan_Wood says, "I'm a writer, but not in the IF genre. I've got a concept for a game, yet no puzzles nor anything other than plot." lpsmith asks, "Does that answer your question?" Adam says, "Eeeagh! Three dots, pleez." lpsmith says, "Sorry." cody hums 3 dots and fakes it. Dan_Wood says, "In a sense, yes. Thank you." Adam raises his hand. lpsmith calls on Adam. Dan_Wood thwaps Adam as he walks back to his seat. Adam asks, "What scenarios might you include in the sequel, should there be one? Do you think there's any point in history where the model breaks down, or can you see Level 714: Programming Your VCR?" lpsmith laughs. Saudade is coloring her dot to dot book, and laughs at Adam. Dan_Wood chuckles. lpsmith says, "Should there be a sequel, I'd probably start where the last one left off, probably with agriculture. Dunno where I'd go after that." lpsmith says, "..." Dan_Wood yells at the stage, "Invention of the HTADS interpreter!" lpsmith says, "Although it would be an interesting challenge to try to code up some more recent modern advances." lpsmith says, "Or the abstract ones Saudade mentioned earlier." lpsmith calls on DorianX. Saudade says, "Like, cut and paste dueling." lpsmith says, "(assuming Adam's question was answered satisfactually)" Adam says, "You bet." inky raises his hand. DorianX says, "Okey Dokey. Playing off of Dan_Wood's question..." Dan_Wood drives around in a golf cart. DorianX asks, "What's (in your mind) the difference betwixt a "challenge" in the plot and a puzzle?" Saudade says, "Good question." lpsmith says, "Ideally, nothing. At least for the types of challenges/puzzles I'd like to write. But if you were to separate the two, I'd define a plot challenge as something that might happen in a regular novel, and a puzzle as something you might find in 'Games'." lpsmith says, "The line between the two is pretty fuzzy, though." DorianX likes the "Ideally nothing" part. lpsmith asks, "If there's no followup--inky?" inky asks, "can you tell us more about this game developer's conference?" lpsmith says, "There's another set of articles I've written for XYZZY--dunno how many will be used, but whatever doesn't get in there, I'll post to the ng. ..." lpsmith says, "However, some highlights--I got to see a wonderful lecture by Brian Moriarty entitled 'Entrain', about the patterns and the rhythms that develop between a player and the game they're playing ..." lpsmith says, "I also attended a round table about 'Gender Inclusive Gaming', which was interesting. ..." cody says, "Got to go. Thanks lp." cody has disconnected. cody goes home. [cody] trips and dies. lpsmith says, "Also, there was a talk by, uh, forget his name. Presedent of SPI in the 70's. Jim Dunnigan, that's it. He talked about 'Rapid Application Development' ..." lpsmith exclaims, "RAD being creating prototype games quickly, so you could find the ones that worked. It occured to me that text adventures would be an ideal medium to do RAD for gaming companies. Now, to find someone to sell the idea to!" inky says, "I've got a followup question then." lpsmith says, "Go for it." inky says, "any idea when the next issue of xyzzynews is coming out? :)" lpsmith laughs. JCZorkmid laughs. lpsmith says, "Hopefully soon, but I have no control over that, unfortunately. ..." Dan_Wood says, "Shortly befor 3000 AD" lpsmith says, "Actually, Eileen tends to publish after she gets enough articles, so if you have any ideas, send them in, and it'll get out faster! " Saudade asks, "Other questions from the floor?" (From JCZorkmid) Floor asks, "Could you wash your feet next time?" (From Adam) The floor asks, "Could you all stop standing on me? It hurts!" inky laughs. lpsmith says, "Timing,..." Adam says (to JC), "Damn you." JCZorkmid giggles. Saudade smiles JCZorkmid raises hand. lpsmith says, "The conference was a blast. I was really glad I got to go. And I got Brian to sign my Trinity map, and a certificate I made as a prize for next year's comp." lpsmith asks (to JCZ), "Yes?" JCZorkmid says, "I'm not sure if this has been asked and I missed it, but..." lpsmith says, "'sokay." JCZorkmid asks, "Any idea when your next IF project will be released?" lpsmith says, "None at all. ..." lpsmith says, "One idea I've had that I like is to publish something serially. ..." Dan_Wood raises a hand JCZorkmid ooohs lpsmith says, "Kinda like the way Dickens wrote--one chapter at a time. Or like B5 ;-) ..." [greeny] greeny has connected to ifMUD. greeny has arrived. lpsmith says, "Dunno if it'll see the light of day, but I liked writing a relatively short game, and think it would be more satisfying to get feedback as I went, instead of coding up some monster, only to have it not go over very well." JCZorkmid says, "cool. thanks." lpsmith asks, "Dan?" Adam says, "Heh. I can see how serial publication might mesh with plot trees. 'Did you pick up the coin? If so, play game3.z5...'" lpsmith grins. DorianX says, "Hm... might be a good use for extended save and restore" (From Adam) C:\> FROTZ GAME3.Z5 Dan_Wood says (to lpsmith), "Wouldja work with a newbie writer on a game? :)" lpsmith says (to DX), "Exactly." (From Adam) First words: *** You have died *** lpsmith grins. lpsmith says, "That would depend on the circumstances, but I'd at least be willing to be a consultant. Sorta like a early beta tester." lpsmith says (to Dan), "If you're serious, talk to me later. My e-mail's lpsmith@rice.edu if you want to use that." [evin] evin has connected to ifMUD. Dan_Wood scrawls that down on his PIPBoy 3000 (From JCZorkmid) HKHunter sends spam to lpsmith@rice.edu. lpsmith chuckles. Saudade shakes Lucian's ape-like hand and says "Well, you have been an engaging speaker, Lucian, (and an expert cut-and-paste duelist). Thanks so much for coming and sharing with us! It's free-for-all time now! lpsmith bows once more. DorianX exclaims, "Yay!!!" Taj applauds. Saudade claps and cheers JCZorkmid cheers wildly. Grocible claps lpsmith exclaims (to Saudade), "Thanks for hosting this, yet again!" mkimball cheers Saudade smiles JCZorkmid cheers wildly again. Dan_Wood pennant-waves. DorianX asks (to Saudade), "So, who'se next on your hit list?" evin has arrived. lpsmith suggested MikeBerlyn. greeny shakes his watch & puts it to his ear Saudade says (to dorianx), "I have a couple of possibilities so far, am still working on them. Ivan is one." lpsmith says (to greeny), "Oops." greeny says (to Lpsmith), "Exactly" Dan_Wood bbiaw's. Dan_Wood has disconnected. Dan_Wood goes home. [Dan_Wood] You hear a slight click as Dan_Wood's connection to the mud terminates. Saudade says, "People have also asked for Berlyn, and I'm interested in talking with a woman writer, maybe Bonnie Montgomery." inky applauds belatedly. inky asks (to Saudade), "uh, which one's she, again?" Saudade says, "Firebird author." inky can never keep all the Bonni*'s straight.